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  • toneyrn
    Newcomer - Level 1
    2020-06-12
    I'm new to Midas digital mixers, but quite experienced with audio in general and have used a digital mixer of another brand that uses a computer to control it via ethernet. I'm trying to use M32-Edit on a Macbook Pro to control a M32C which is hooked up to a DL32. The stage box and the mixer appear to be talking to each other, at least the light on the front of the stage box turns green. I ran a Cat5 cable from the ethernet port on the Mac the Ethernet Remote port on the M32C, which is illustrated in the manual. I can't seem to get M32-Edit to connect to the mixer. Do I need a router? The hookup diagram doesn't show that. HELP!
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    0 384
    • toneyrn
      balky Yes. You need a router. The mixer has to be on the same network as your computer/ipad/phone etc from which you are attempting to connect to mixer. The ip address of the mixer will be issued by router. Or you can manually assign it in mixer preferences according to your network setup. :)
      • June 12, 2020
    • toneyrn
      DaveMorrison You don't need a router, but it's a lot easier if you do. You'll have to go to Network Preferences and create Static IP addresses because neither the Mac or the M32 has a DHCP server. Like Pavel K said, get a router.
      • June 12, 2020
  • dendong
    Contributor - Level 1
    2019-06-23

    Hi,

    We are currently setting up Midas M32 and Mackie DL32R connection using Dante card. However, we do not clearly understand routing of M32 and DL32R. We would like to have M32 to control all inputs and outputs from DL32R. The routing will be like this, Inputs (mic) > DL32R > Midas > DL32R > Outputs (monitors, main L/R). Below is our current routing configuration for M32 and DL32R where only inputs 1-32 of DL32R can be controlled at M32. Meaning, we can only adjust gains of DL32R inputs thru input faders of M32 but the DL32R outputs cannot be controlled thru M32 ouput faders.

    M32

    Routing > Inputs (card 1-8, 9-16, 17-24, 24-32)

    Routing > Card out (Out 1-8, 9-16), since DL32R has 14 outputs only with 13 & 14 as Main L/R

    Routing > Output (DirectOut Ch 1-16), post fader

    DL32R

    Routing > Dante (Dante 1-32 > Mic Pre 1-32)

    Routing > Input A (Ch 1-32 > Dante 1-32)

    Routing > Output (XLR 1-14 > Dante 1-14), 13 & 14 as Main L/R

    We hope someone could help us regarding the basic routing as we are newbie to digital audio networking. 

    Thank you.

     

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    • dendong
      DaveMorrison

      @dendong 


      If I understand your question correctly, wouldn't you want the outputs from the M32 to be Bus 1-12 and LR on 13&14?  If this is the case, then set Routing 1-16 to be Mix Bus 1....12 to Output 1....12 and Main L&R to Output 13&14 (all post fader).


      The Card Out routing looks correct if the Routing 1-16 is set to the above. 


      If you need more help, Upload your scene file.


      Here are (older) instructions for saving a scene. Remember to ZIP the file or it won't upload. https://behringerwiki.musictribe.com/index.php?title=Uploading_files_to_the_forum

      • June 23, 2019
  • jon9max
    Contributor - Level 3
    2019-07-04

    Hello, I'm new. Very new. I don't even have the equipment yet.

    I am going to have an M32C with a DL32. I am having it all racked up so we can use it for stereo IEM's, with a split for FOH.

    This is a large band, 11 people, and there will be 6-7 stereo IEM's and just about all 32 inputs will be filled.

    I am doing all I can to learn about the unit so we can get to work right away when I get this next week. 

    It seems if you use all of the Physical outputs you can't use the effects? (I know the mix busses, but...)What does one have to do with the other? Am I missing something? There are 16 phys. outputs and 16 "mix busses" Did they not think people would not use up the physical outputs and the mix busses to go with them and Not want some reverb?

    As I said, I don't know. Is there something I'm missing totally? Is there a workaround?

    Thanks in advance! 

     

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    • jon9max
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi John @jon9max,


      Welcome to the forum. Yes you are misunderstanding how the M32 engine is designed. Physical outputs are separate entities from the mixbuses. What I would suggest you do is to download the M32-Edit app (PC, Mac, linux and/or Raspberry Pi) and have a look at how everything is laid out.


       


      There are 16 mixbuses that can be used to mix channel sends and output to various destinations, including physical outputs. Typically it is setup to use the first 12 mixbuses for monitor mixes or 6 mixbus stereo pairs, or a combination thereof. The last 3 mixbuses are typically used to mix channel sends to be sent to the first 4 Fx slots (side-chain) as the dry signal inputs. The wet signals are returned in stereo pair channel inputs (on the Aux layer channel strips 9-16), which can then be sent to the Main LR and/or any of the monitor mixes.


       


      Assignments to the physical outputs are done in the Routing section and is accomplished in a 2 step process. First individual outputs are assigned to individual physical outputs on the Out 1-16, Aux Out or Ultranet. Then these outputs are assigned to the AES50 in banks of 8 of those individual assignments.


       


      The best thing to do is play around with the M32-Edit, then ask questions here as they come up. That's how I got started back in Dec 2012 when my church got their X32. Because I was new to the digital mixing world, I ended up asking lots of questions.


       

      • July 3, 2019
    • jon9max
      jon9max

      Thanks so much Paul! 


      I do have the M32 edit program and I am setting up as much as I can prior to getting the unit. That’s what brought me here with my question. You basically restated my question with your solution. When you said “typically” it is used in such a way...


      What I’m asking, is if I use the mix busses to control the stereo IEM’s, can I use effects? 

      • July 3, 2019
    • jon9max
      Paul_Vannatto


      @jon9max wrote:


      Thanks so much Paul! 


      When you said “typically” it is used in such a way...


      That is the way it is setup from the factory and I normally leave it that way. Fortunately it does give the ability to change that. For example, if you need 7 stereo IEM capability, you could use mixbuses 1-14 and use only the last 2 (15 and 16) for sends to 2 of the FX slots.


      What I’m asking, is if I use the mix busses to control the stereo IEM’s, can I use effects? 


      Yes of course you can. There are 2 ways of using the effects - sidechain or insert. Reverbs, delays, etc. work best using the side chain method, which requires a mixbus to feed them.





       

      • July 3, 2019
    • jon9max
      jon9max

      Ok, So can I insert them, then?  (I do know how they work best, but it looks like I'm not gonna be able to do it that way. It just seems wacky that the outputs are kinda tied to the mix buses, well, that there aren't more mix busses if you are using them to control the outputs for Iem's/monitors.) But It's so we can get a little reverb in the IEM's just so vocals and drums won't be completely dry. I haven't found a way to insert them.  Inserted to a subgroup an input channel? (subgroup would be great) 


      thank you,


      John

      • July 4, 2019
    • jon9max
      BillHood

      Hi @jon9max . Paul is the expert so you have the right person helping you out. Just thought I would chime in, as you asked about any workarounds... but I will note the DL32 has ADAT out for 17 through 32. I have often wondered if ADAT out to an ADA8200 wouldn't provide more physical outputs, but I don't need them so have never tried.


       


      Alternatively, with 11 folks and 6-7 stereo IEM's I figure you are anticipating some shared mixes or wedges or similar? If you can work it with your group, using a couple of mix bus for compiling/grouping several channels like to a 'drum' L 'drum' R, you might be able to get away with using a couple of the P16 system in addition to the 16 physical outs. Downside is P16 only allows 16 assignments, which I find a real drawback. 


       


      Idea might be mix bus 1-12 are individual L-R mixes and go to 12 of your physical outs for 6 stereo IEM, and you have 4 physical outs for Subs and Mains


       


      Bus 13 and 14 then are 'drum' LR, bus 15 and 16 are for effects send. Or some combination of the above, whatever fits your need. Then for the P16 system you can assign the 'grouped' mix bus 13 and 14, where you can also mix in some of your effects returns to add reverb, then 14 other individual channels.


      Not ideal I know, but maybe useful... also note the M32C has 'Monitor Out L and R' - I use those physical outs for my IEM as well. Still uses 2 mix bus, but is 2 more physical outs... just have to use some creative routining.

      • July 4, 2019
  • ww-audio
    Contributor - Level 2
    2020-01-18

    Hello everybody

    I just changed the batterie following those instructions from Midas:

    "As for the battery, a good battery should last about 2 years however if the console is left in very cold storage it can deplete the battery and if it falls below 3v DC it can reset the BIOS. With the console off for several hours you can always check the battery health by using a multimeter to measure the voltage, if it is +3.3v DC it should be good but if it is reading low it is advised to power the console ON and change it once the console has booted up -this must be done with the power on otherwise it will reset the BIOS."

    So you open the plate with all th faders an lift and secure it only where the faders are (abbout 15 cm). You can see it sticking on the mainboard on the right.

    In my cas i's a CR 2032. As you have to change it under power you do not want to use a ply to lift it out. Just pull the security-latch aside and lift it out with some sharp-end plastic tool.

    Hope this will help somebody.

    cheers

    Werner

     

     

     

     

     

     

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  • allesbl
    Contributor - Level 2
    2020-02-10

    Hi,

    I don't know if this is the right place to report bugs, but I'll place my post here. Hopefully it will be read by someone responsible for MR18 maintenance and support.

    One month ago I bought MR18 mixer and updated the firmware to latest 1.17 version. Then during tests I found out that the unit can produce a very loud squeal on Main LR output and any Bus 1-6 output after powering it up. As I found later, it was already mentioned in this forum here:

    https://community.musictribe.com/t5/Recording/MR18-Power-On-Start-Up-Noise/td-p/185693

    and here:

    https://community.musictribe.com/t5/Recording/Loud-squeal-after-powering-up-MR18/td-p/180023

    The squeal sound from my MR18 sounds exactly the same as the one posted by Jay Haynes in the first thread.

    This was posted in 2017 and I wonder it is not fixed yet, because the mixer can become really dangerous when power is unexpectedly interrupted and then restored - not only blasting the PA loudspeakers at Main LR, but with in-ears connected to Bus 1-6 it may cause serious hearing damage!!!

    Sorry, but such behaviour of a professional, even Midas-branded product is simply unacceptable, regardless as much as the product is low-priced. Competitor products such as Mackie DL32R don't do this - on power up and after an initial silent period it simply starts to pass audio with last settings applied. No glitches,
    no pops.

    Please, don't state now "you should turn on the mixer first and speakers last". Although this is of course fully true, in a real life with real fallible people it cannot be always fulfilled under all circumstances. An unexpected short power dropout with MR18 is enough to cause big problems, e.g. someone pulls out by mistake the power cord from the socket and then puts it back again.

    Workaround with "Mute at power on" setup option is insufficient. It relies on a user action and therefore is not always guaranteed, despite the sentence in manual "Engage the 'Mute at Power On' to avoid pops during start up." Not to mention, there is no hint of how loud the MR18 "pops" can be. Under "pops" I understand loud but very short signal bursts which can be unpleasant, but mostly not destructive. However, the mixer produces maybe 0.5 sec long squeal signal with wide spectrum and full scale amplitude which totally overdrives anything connected to the outputs.
    Often it could be also required that the device resumes operation after power cycling with last settings applied and without any user intervention. In this case "Mute at power on" option cannot be used.

    Nevertheless, not only to complain, but to be a bit constructive too - with my MR18 I could observe following behaviour:

    - the squeal sound comes from any input channel (1-16, line 17-18) to any Bus 1-6 and/or Main LR output when channel bus sends and/or channel fader are turned up. Bus and main masters are set permanently to 0dB. Squeal to buses comes from all possible tap point selections.

    - the squeal sound comes only from input channels which have a physical input patched. If the channel is not patched (OFF in the routing table) or USB is selected as source, then the squeal sound doesn't appear. Also effect returns don't produce squeal sound, supposed effect sends on all inputs are all the way turned down.

    - the squeal sound doesn't come out of Phones output. There seems to be some automatic muting during power up - phones output is quiet until the squeal on main/bus outputs fades away and then starts to play normally.

    So this would definitely point to an issue with A/D converters / preamps during initialization.

    Such kind of issue can be for sure fixed by a firmware update. If the root cause cannot be solved easily, please apply to all outputs at least automatic muting immediately on boot up, as a first step of the initialization sequence, and automatic unmuting just only after the initialization has been completed and the squeal already faded away. Automatic unmute would take place conditionally depending on the "Mute at power on" setting: TRUE = leave outputs muted until user intervention (same as now), FALSE = unmute automatically after squeal is gone.
    Or maybe a different approach: temporarily reset the routing table at startup so that all channels are not patched and restore it only just after the A/D and preamps have settled properly.
    Adding such relatively simple functionality to next firmware update may well improve the user experience of this - so far working good - product.

    Many thanks in advance!

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    • allesbl
      GaryHiggins

      @allesbl In setup, audio/midi "mute output at power cycle" needs to have a check mark in the box.


      z.PNG.

      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi Ales @allesbl 


      Welcome to the forum. I can assure you that this "squeal" is not due to a bug in the firmware, or it would be happening to many of us users. As far as I remember, those 2 threads were the only reports of this issue, and we were unable to replicate the problem ourselves. If you notice that in both cases, the user(s) did not provide a scene file for us to check. I would suggest that you export your scene to a file (using M-Air-Edit for PC, Mac or linux) and attach it to your next post (Choose File below). Then we can have a look and see if we can determine the source of the squeal.


       

      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      allesbl

      Hi Paul,


      thank you for welcome and your quick reaction. Enclosed you can find a .scn file with the setting which produces the squeal on my MR18. Basically, it is a factory default routing with my personal EQ, gate and compressor settings for a small band as a start point for sound check. Channel 14 has the fader and bus sends turned up which is the path for "squeal" to all outputs. If you load this scene into the mixer, wait some time to store it into inernal memory, switch the mixer off and then switch it on back again, you should get the "squeal" on all bus/main outputs during startup - providing that "mute at power on" is not set, I don't know if this is stored in the scene too. If you unpatch the channel 14 to OFF or set the source to USB, then the disturbing sound will not come at next startup. If you repeat this settings on any other input channel 1-16, 17-18, you should get the same result at next power up.


      My unit has serial number S190700210C8H. From my point of view this is definitely a bug. I discovered it randomly, because I'm used to test everything properly before real use, including such "abnormal operation" like power cycling with open loudspeakers and in-ears. Hopefully the attached file will help you to replicate the squeal sound at startup.


       

      ch14-patched-in14_squeal.scn
      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi Ales @allesbl ,


      Thanks for the scene file. I was able to replicate the issue and that was definitely not a squeal. It was more like a synthesizer noise. To be honest, that is the very first time I've heard that come out of the MR18 (or XR18 or X32) in all the years (and many events) that I've done sound with these digital mixers. Granted the norm is to hook everything up, turn on the console, then go around and turn on all of the powered speakers (and do the opposite at the end of the event). But occasionally I do find a powered speaker already on (because someone forgot to turn it off at teardown of last event). 


       


      I do have to admit that you did indeed find a bug. But you have to understand that since no one has provided a scene file to replicate it, it was very difficult to investigate the "bug". Add to that, the  majority of issues we encounter here on the forum are user setting related. We did have a similar scenario with a user with a bizarre EQ settings (on the GEQ) on his X32. With his scene file we were able to replicate it and I sent it off to the developers - and they found the bug. 


       


      I did load one of my good known scenes over top of yours and tried it and got a similar noise. So I initialized the console, then loaded my good known scene and there was a minor pop (expected when you have the powered speaker on before turning on the console), but did not get your (weird) noise. So it is definitely a combination of settings in your scene that is producing this output.


       


      I will inform the developers of this and link your explanation and scene file for an investigation.


       

      • February 10, 2020
  • Angelos7
    Contributor - Level 2
    2019-07-18

    2 M32 + 1 DL32 sharing gain....is there any follow up gain feature that can be used at "slave console" to auto correct any gain changes from the"master console"????

    0 364
    • Angelos7
      DaveMorrison

      @Angelos7 Yes. There is a trim control for the console not controlling the pre-amps.

      • July 18, 2019
    • Angelos7
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi Angelos @Angelos7,


      Welcome to the forum. Yes you can enable the HA Gain Sharing (Setup, Preamps screen) that will provide each console with digital trim (+-18 db) on each channel strip. What that means is that the console that has control of the physical preamps (gains, phantom) will have to adjust the physical gains on the Setup, Preamps screen).


       

      • July 18, 2019
    • Angelos7
      KevinMaxwell

      Let’s for example say you are talking about a FOH console as the master and the Monitor console as the Slave. I assume that what you are asking for is can the monitor console auto correct what the master console just did. In Other Words if a person on the FOH console just increases the preamp gain on a vocal mic is there a feature that will then decrease the gain (or trim) on the monitor console so that mix doesn’t change.


       


      The answer is no this feature is not in the M32 console system, at least not in an automated sense. It can be done manually but not automatically. This is why people recommend a hard wired or transformer split before the consoles preamps for a 2 console system with one at FOH and another one at Monitor world, so what one mix person does doesn’t affect the other mix person.

      • July 18, 2019
  • CayeTorres
    Contributor - Level 2
    2019-12-24

    Hi everyone! I have a problem with which I am not able to move forward. I have a Midas M32 as a FOH console and a DL32 stage box. Recently I bought the M32C console to use as a monitor console. The connectivity process says that if I want the master console to be the M32 of foh, internal synchronization must be selected. This console enters the aes50 A port of the stage and the M32C enters the aes50B port of the stage. The routings are done as Midas indicates in the video that I leave below, but my main problem is that I can not modify anything or gain or, eqs ... Come on, that the M32C ignores me. Could someone help me with this? Thank you very much in advance!

    https://youtu.be/JujdVMtQ1hs

    sorry for my english!

     

     

     

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    • CayeTorres
      RexBeckett

      @CayeTorres 


      Hi Cayetano, welcome to the community.


       


      Only the console connected to AES50 port A of the DL32 can adjust the preamp gains and select phantom power. The console connected to DL32 AES50-B port has +-18dB of digital trim on each of the inputs. With the exception of the preamp gains, both consoles can process the inputs as required with EQ and dynamics.

      • December 24, 2019
    • CayeTorres
      CayeTorres

      Rex, thank you very much for your response. I really didn't know that the gains were only controlled by the console that enters through the aes50a port of the DL32. But my problem is that when I try to change an eq to a channel, or a gate, or a compression from the iPad (which is how I operate the M32c) it ignores me. And another thing I have doubts about is the following: ¿Do I have to load a show or scenes through the USB input of the M32C or with the internal synchronization selected from the M32 should the same scene appear on the iPad?   Hopefully together we can find the solution. thanks and sorry again for my english!

      • December 24, 2019
    • CayeTorres
      RexBeckett


      @CayeTorres wrote:


      Rex, thank you very much for your response. I really didn't know that the gains were only controlled by the console that enters through the aes50a port of the DL32. But my problem is that when I try to change an eq to a channel, or a gate, or a compression from the iPad (which is how I operate the M32c) it ignores me. And another thing I have doubts about is the following: ¿Do I have to load a show or scenes through the USB input of the M32C or with the internal synchronization selected from the M32 should the same scene appear on the iPad?   Hopefully together we can find the solution. thanks and sorry again for my english!





      @CayeTorres 


      Do you have any control of the M32C from your iPad? There have been some recently reported problems with compatibility issues between the M32 app and iOS versions. I believe channel settings were affected.


       


      With your system configuration, there is no communication between the two consoles except that the FOH console provides the master sync to the M32C through the DL32. Each console will have its own settings. When you load a scene on the M32C, the settings should show on the app if the iPad is correctly connected to the console's network port.


       


      If you want to use the M32C as a monitor console and send the mixes to the DL32 outputs, your current configuration will not work - only the FOH M32 can send to the DL32 outputs. Instead you need to configure the system as:


       


      M32 AES50-B <--> AES50-A M32C AES50-B <--> AES50-A DL32 


       


      The M32C will, by default, have full control of the DL32 preamps and can send to the DL32 outputs. The M32C will route all the DL32 inputs to the M32 and can, if required, route outputs from the M32 to the DL32. We can help you with the routing if you tell us how you want the inputs and outputs arranged. 

      • December 24, 2019
    • CayeTorres
      CayeTorres

      @RexBeckett @GaryHiggins 


      Thank you very much for your help. I will try to connect everything this way then M32 AES50-B <--> AES50-A M32CAES50-B <--> AES50-A DL32 the routing would be as follows: outputs 1-8 for in ears, out 14 sub, out 15 L out 16 R   If you need any more information I will be happy to give it to you! Thanks again!

      • December 25, 2019
    • CayeTorres
      RexBeckett


      @CayeTorres wrote:


      @RexBeckett @GaryHiggins 


      Thank you very much for your help. I will try to connect everything this way then M32 AES50-B <--> AES50-A M32CAES50-B <--> AES50-A DL32 the routing would be as follows: outputs 1-8 for in ears, out 14 sub, out 15 L out 16 R   If you need any more information I will be happy to give it to you! Thanks again!





      @CayeTorres 


      This routing assumes that you are running firmware V4.01 on the M32C. It could be done with V3.12 if necessary.


       


      All 32 M32C Inputs come from the DL32 on AES50-B:


      M32C Input RoutingM32C Input Routing


      The M32C sends all 32 inputs to the M32 over AES50-A. It also sends outputs to the DL32 using the User Out crosspoint (see later).


      M32C AES50 Routing.M32C AES50 Routing.


      The M32 takes all 32 inputs coming from M32C over AES50-B:


      M32 Input RoutingM32 Input Routing


      All 16 M32 outputs are sent to the M32C over AES50-B:


      M32 AES RoutingM32 AES Routing


      In the M32C, the User Out crosspoint is used to route local outputs 1-12 and M32 outputs 14-16 to the DL32:


      M32C User OutM32C User Out


      Let us know if you have questions or need any changes.

      • December 25, 2019
  • Alphasounds
    Contributor - Level 2
    2020-01-12

    After the update giging Yesterday was no fun.

    The Desk did run so smmoth and now : The Slow Faders could be tolerated, but EQ of Fader is  a Sticking mess, also the Pots on Parametric jump or lagging. I Mannaged, but i really neeed to fix this.

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    • Alphasounds
      GaryHiggins

      @Alphasounds There is a fix on the way with firmware 4.02-supposedly soon. Until then I would suggest going back to 3.12 by way of first loading 3.07. 3.07 (specific) sets your M32 faders back the way they used to be, then loading 3.12 will get all back to what you are used to. Before doing that you might want to try and re load 4.01 again as maybe it didn't load properly. I have an M32R and do not have those issues but perhaps a full M32 reacts in a different way.


       


      If you don't have 3.07 I can post a dropbox link...it was until recently among the "legacy" firmware options but may no longer be...

      • January 11, 2020
    • Alphasounds
      Alphasounds

      Thank You, So 1rst 3.7 and then 3.1 but this sounds like spending a lot of hrs for the Hope just going back were i starded.


       

      • January 11, 2020
    • Alphasounds
      GaryHiggins

      @Alphasounds It's 3.07 and then 3.12. It doesn't take long, no more than 5 min for each firmware update once you have the files. BTW this is not an official fix but it worked perfectly for me...more than once...as I wanted to try 4.01 again with the slower faders AND the new routing menus. That said you should do it at your own risk. You can just go directly back to 3.12 but the slow fader part remains, I was not happy with that choice.

      • January 11, 2020
    • Alphasounds
      Alphasounds

      Thank You, the Scary part was not the speed, a lot of eq faders are in need to be kind of woken up and then used. Dissapointing. Have You got a link for the 2 old Firmware versions handy ?

      • January 11, 2020
    • Alphasounds
  • kevonavitch
    Contributor - Level 1
    2020-07-23

    Hi,

    I have a few MIDAS DP48s for the band members. Running them from X32/M32 mixers. Been able to import group names and manually program groups. But I have not been able to figure out how to use the Auto Assign by group or color features. Do you need a HUB4 to use this capability?

    Also, I found an AES50 Group name assignment feature in the Library section of the X32-Edit software. I can input the information there but don't know how to push it out to the DP48. Does it also require a HUB4 to allow this feature to work?

    Thanks!

    Kevin

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    • kevonavitch
      Paul_Vannatto Hi Kevin,

      Are you getting the channel names and colors in the DP48 via AES50? If so the auto assign by color should work (based on those channel colors). I haven't used that feature for over a year now.

      The AES50 section of the library should work (as long as you are using X32 firmware 4.02 and DP48 firmware 1.4). You need to put the DP48 in slave mode (in the Setup). Then in the AES50 library (of X32) select broadcast to A or B (depending on which AES50 port you are using for the DP48)
      • July 22, 2020
    • kevonavitch
      kevonavitch Thanks, Paul. I really appreciate the quick answer. I had firmware 4.01 on the M32C and the new 1.5 on the DP48. Update the first. My issue might have been that I forgot to turn on the internal clock on the M32C (usually it is slaved to the X32 as a monitor mixer). I was able to get it to both pick up the auto assign and the library broadcast features. Worked beautifully!

      I had another question about where to tap the signal but I'll start another thread to create a separate headline.
      • July 24, 2020
      • MIDAS DP48 Auto Assign Groups by Name/Color
        Paul_Vannatto Ah yes, 4.01 had issues. Updating to 4.02 will help. Glad to hear you got it working. I'll watch for your other thread.
        • 1
        • ·
        • July 24, 2020
      • MIDAS DP48 Auto Assign Groups by Name/Color
        kevonavitch Another thought came to mind. When I first tried it, it was from my X32. But I had the DP48 daisy-chained after our SD16 stage box. Does the stage box potential strip out the channel messages from the X32. I think I recall reading that the DP48 should be wired first (which seems risky). And if that is the necessary to allow the channel messages to reach the DP48, how much latency would each box add to the signal in the chain (we have 3)?

        Sorry for all the questions! I'm finding it hard to get clear answers online since the product is so new.
        • July 24, 2020
      • MIDAS DP48 Auto Assign Groups by Name/Color
        kevonavitch I'm back in the practice room testing. It seems the stage boxes are the problem. When I put the AES50 directly in to the DP48, the broadcast works. With my two SD16s in between, the message does not reach. I notice the latest DP48 firmware talks about allowing name commands to go through stage boxes (I have 1.5 installed). I suspect I may have to update the firmware for the SD16s. Will give that a try and report back.

        Thanks again for your help, Paul.
        • July 25, 2020
  • New
    Dberry
    Newcomer - Level 1
    2021-04-10

    Hi guys. I just got an M32 for FOH. I want to be able to use all 16 buses for stereo sub mixes and effects sends at FOH.

    I then want to use the X32 Rack that is on SR as the monitor board, using 1-14 busses for monitors.

    I want the gain knob on the x32 Rack to be my master gain for both boards so I can set gain onstage while getting instrument level checks from the band.

    I want the s16 by the drums for inputs 1-16 (drums and some back line instrument) and the the x32 Rack inputs for 17-32 (frontline vocals and instruments. 

    *EDIT* 
    I want outputs 1-8 to come from the x32 Rack for monitor mixes or L and R
    I want outputs 9-16 to come from the S16 for monitor mixes or L and R
    LEFT and RIGHT can come from either the S16 or the X32
    *END EDIT*

    The M32 at FOH will not require any input or outputs except for a talkback mic to communicate with the band and or audiance anouchments and a laptop into a set of Aux's for music playback. All that will be running to FOH will be the talk back mic, laptop and an Eithercon cable.

    My main goal here is to be able to use all 16 busses at FOH for 12 sub mixes and 4 FX's. Then have all 16 buses on stage from the X32 rack and s16 for monitor mixes.

    I won't have a monitor engineer so I thought I would set gain on stage and setup a quick wedge and IEM mix for the band, then move to FOH for sound check. Since I am running IEMs I want to be able to make EQ, gate, and Comp adustments at FOH without it chaining their IEM mixes. I am not that thrilled about have two Seperate board mixes but I do want all of my FOH buses for sub mixes so I can compress the sub mixes and make group eq changes on the sub mixes. 

    Is this possible, or is there a better way. I just don't want to eat up all of my FOH buses on monitors and not have them available for effects and sub mixes. 

    read more...
    0 361
    • Dberry
      Paul_Vannatto Hi Danny, for the most part, most everything you listed that you want can be done, except for the following:
      * "outputs 15 and 16 to come from the X32 Rack for Left and Right to the mains". The X32 Rack does not have physical outputs 15/16. It has 8 XLR outputs and 6 Aux (1/4") output levels.
      * The Main LR from FOH should not be routed to the X32 Rack Aux Outs, due to a slight drop in outputs.
      * Also the 4 IEM's should be stereo. Those that use IEMs prefer stereo rather than mono.
      * What about outputs for subs?
      Looking at those requirement, I would suggest you consider adding another stagebox, such as the SD8 that would provide more physical outputs.
      • Apr 10
      • Need routing assistance for m32 FOH, X32 rack stage monitor mixer and S16 digital snake
        Dberry Yes your right. I said 15 and 16 meaning 7 and 8 because of the outputs. As you know, I have 8 on the s16 and 8 on the x32 so i just misstated the number. So really from the x32 it would be better to have 1-4 got to IEM in the rack the 5-8 going to Front line monitors (4 mixes). Then I could use 1-4 from the s16 for drum monitor and 3 other wedge mixes. 7 and 8 from the S16 could run to the main L R.
        • Apr 10
    • Dberry
      CraigFowler Need some clarification. In the first sentence you say you want to use the M32's 16 buses for stereo submixes and *FX* sends at FOH. That's fine.
      Later on you say that your main goal is to use all 16 buses at FOH for 12 submixes and 4 *monitor* sends. If you're doing this, presumably you want to output those monitor sends on stage. Given that you've only got 16x XLR on stage, and you're already using 14x of them for the Rack's buses + 2x of them for LR from the FOH console, where were you planning to output those extra 4x monitor sends from FOH?

      Presuming you meant FOH buses only get used for FOH things, as Paul mentions, 14x monitors from the X32Rack + LR from FOH can fit on the 16x XLR sockets between the X32Rack and the S16. However you've said that you only want to use 4x outputs on the S16 for bus 9-12, which means trying to fit 12x signals on the X32Rack's 8x XLR outputs, which doesn't fit. You could use the X32Rack's TRS sockets for the other 4x signals, however personally I'd prefer to not use the X32Rack's TRS outputs, as they have 5dB less headroom than the XLR sockets. A patricularly hot mix may be fine on the XLR sockets, but might clip on the TRS sockets. If you don't want to buy any additional hardware like an SD8 to get extra output sockets, you may have to use more than 4 outputs on the S16, or make sure that the mixes you're outputing on the X32Rack's TRS sockets aren't too hot.

      As Paul also mentions, you mention using outputs 1-8 on the X32Rack for 4x IEMs + 4x wedges. This indicates that the IEMs will be mono. If you can save buses at all, try to get IEMs stereo. Musicians find it a lot easier with IEMs if you can give them a stereo band mix and run their own channels straight up the middle. If the X32Rack is only being used for monitors, you can use its LR bus as a separate stereo mix (if you can make the physical output for it.)

      Re the gain; if you're not going to have a Monitor Engineer, you may as well set the FOH console to control gain, then once it's set enable HA gain split on FOH so that further gain changes won't affect monitors. You could also control the X32Rack from the Laptop @ FOH using Edit if you can run an extra Ethernet cable from the stage to FOH and have a router. Either of these solutions mean you don't have to actually set gain on the Rack; you can do everything from the FOH mix position. If you are going to dial in quick wedge mixes from stage, I'd recommend you involve a wifi router and a tablet so you can stand in front of the wedges as you dial it in, instead of trying to do it from sidestage.

      If you are going to be trying to mix monitors from the FOH mix position, I'd recommend routing the X32Rack's solo bus back to FOH, and using Edit on the laptop\tablet @ FOH connected to the X32Rack so you can solo the monitor mixes from the FOH mix position and hear your changes.

      PS, If you don't have a Monitor Engineer, running FOH for a 32 channel show + 14+ monitor mixes all from FOH is a lot of work for one person... Good luck with it.
      • Apr 10
      • Need routing assistance for m32 FOH, X32 rack stage monitor mixer and S16 digital snake
        Dberry Yes sorry, I meant sub mixes and *FX* at FOH. Also, yes the x32 rack will will be ran from an IPad to ring out monitors and walk around the stage.
        • Apr 10
      • Need routing assistance for m32 FOH, X32 rack stage monitor mixer and S16 digital snake
        Dberry I would love the gain control at FOH but I usually set gain when I am on the stage. When I sound check, I normally stand on stage with the band so I can talk to them. I set gain on every line then while standing with the members in front of their monitors, I set their monitors where I can hear what they are getting. I normally go through level settings with the faders down, then set monitors. Then I have them go back around each input and set FOH EQ, gates, comp, levels. I have always just used a x32 rack and S16 for everything but I am doing a new club install and bought an M32 live board and bought four sets of IEM since a lot of band are using IEMs in conjunction with monitors these days. Because of this FOH won’t use inputs and outputs, just cat 5. I also needed more busses, wanting to keep the 16 FOH for sub mixes and FX and use the stage buses for monitors and IEM. So I am needing help with the routing because I am not real familiar with routing.
        • Apr 10
    • Dberry
      Dberry Let me try to make this easier.

      Gear
      M32 Live FOH (16 busses for 6 stereo sub mixes and 4 FX)
      FOH will have a talk back for announcements and a laptop for playback music through a couple of AUX.
      Router and IPAD for X32 Rack
      X32 Rack - Stage
      S16 Digital - Snake Stage
      4X4 analog snake to run to front of stage for front line monitors and vocal mics.
      6 Wedge Mixes
      4 IEM - Shure PSM 300 (mono or stereo) 4 or 8 outs
      2 outputs (Left and Right)
      So I need 16 Outputs on stage
      I don't run subs on a bus - I have a BSS Blu-100 that runs my mains, so I just run L and R out.

      I like to set levels on stage with the band, then set monitors after line check.
      This is why I like the gain coming from the X32 via the IPAD.
      Then I go to FOH and set EQ, Gates, Comp, and FOH mix.
      I have been running monitors and FOH many years by myself so I have a process as mentioned above. Most players can adjust their monitor mixes as needed during the show from iPhones etc..
      I provide the drummer an IPAD as well for his mix since most drummers use IEMS.
      I can make adjustments as needed from the iPad or X32 edit via router to the X32 rack from FOH during the show as needed for monitor mix changes.
      Is it possible to do the gain split and still have control of gain while at FOH after setting the stage gains?

      With this in mind, I am new to the physical console. I have always just used a X32 Rack and S16 because I have always been a mobile sound guy. I just bought the M32 Live because I am doing a house install in a really nice club.

      With this information how would you setup routing so that I can have these busses as stated above and be able to make FOH changes on the channel strip without it affecting IEM mixes?

      I am a very seasoned sound engineer, just new to the routing of these boards so I am asking for advise on the best way to set it up and some help setting it within all the routing tabs.
      • Apr 10
      • Need routing assistance for m32 FOH, X32 rack stage monitor mixer and S16 digital snake
        Paul_Vannatto Thanks Danny. That looks much better. The only snag I see now is if you have the 4 IEMs in the same rack as the X32 Rack and dedicate the 8 XLR outputs for the stereo feed for those 4 IEMs, that would force you to use the S16 outputs for all wedges and Main LR. If the S16 is to be place beside the drummer (ideal for the inputs), it would make it awkward for the 4 front wedges and Main LR. For that reason I would highly suggest you invest in an SD8 stagebox (8 XLR inputs, 8 XLR outputs, 2 Ultranet) and place it front-center to provide for the 4 front wedges and Main LR.

        I also work as a mobile sound guy with my 2 X32 Racks (one as backup), 2 SD8 and 1 SD16 and find that the flexibility of the added stageboxes is worth its weight in gold. It really reduced the cable spaghetti onstage.

        I can provide the routing for both scenarios (with X32 Rack/S16 and X32 Rack/S16/SD8) if you so wish.

        Regarding the preamp control (gains and phantom), by default, the console closest to the preamps (preamps are an integral part of the XLR jacks) control the preamps and only one console can control the preamps at any one time. Since in your case the X32 is closest to the S16 (connection-wise), if you wish the M32 FOH console to gain control, you would relinquish control on X32 Rack (Setup, preamps, HA Remote, AES50 A or B) to what is connected to the appropriate AES50 port. If you wish a split gain control, you can enable the HA Gain split (Setup, preamps) which will provide all consoles with a digital gain (+-18 db). With that enabled, the console controlling the physical gain would have to do it on the Setup, preamps screen (instead of on the channel strip, config screen).
        • Apr 11
      • Need routing assistance for m32 FOH, X32 rack stage monitor mixer and S16 digital snake
        Dberry I need to buy a few more things for the install so an additional stage box is not on the list currently. I have several analog snakes, one is a 4x4, that I run to the front of the stage for the monitors and vocal mics. Since this is an install, and the snake is 50 foot, I can run it under the stage then up under the drum stage for a clean install and just leave it connected to the S16. Same for the Left and Right Out. I also have various other snakes I can put around the stage as needed.

        In a perfect world I would have everything digital but its not all cheap. Since I am eventually wanting to get a Midas DL32 for the better pre-amps, I would rather save up to buy that then the SD8, but I would still have to run analog snakes to various locations on the stage. Just he nature of the beast I guess.

        I am still not understanding the gain split so for now let keep the gains on the X32 Rack since I set gain on stage with an Ipad then set monitor mixes with the band. I can always use the ipad or M32 edit at the sound booth to make adjustments as needed. Once gain is set, I don't normally make changes because it affects the monitors as well.

        If you can send me the routing for the Midas M32, X32 and S32 setup that would be great.

        The only other thing I can think of is if I could run the talkback to an AUX then somehow feed it to the X32 rack as a talkback into the monitors to talk to the performers as needed from front of house, that would be optimal. I am sure this can be done in routing but as I say, I don't understand the routing as well as mixing and running a stage.
        • Apr 11
    • Dberry
      Dberry I am not set on having a separate monitor mix to deal with but I need the busses because I like to run compression on the sub groups as well as the channels so I can go with light compression on the channels and more aggressive sub compression on the sub mixes. Then I can use DCA's running 1-32 to one DCA and the sub mixes to another DCA. This allows me to change the DCA mix as need to give more dynamics on softer songs then more compression on heavy songs. I use DCA for solo instruments such as turning up guitar solos or lead vocals and effects so I can work on one set of faders, but again this comes from always running an IPAD and wanting to sit on the DCA page once a good mix is set. Im sure I will change my thinking once I start using a physical board. I just don't see enough busses just using the M32 since I have added IEM units for the bands to use in this new club. I looks like i need 16 busses FOH and 14 for stage mixes.
      • Apr 10
    • Dberry
      KevinMaxwell Do you already have the M32 and the X32 rack and the S16? If not I would do it differently. It seems like a waste to use a Behringer stage box and have the Midas pre-amps going to waste in the M32.
      • Apr 11
      • Need routing assistance for m32 FOH, X32 rack stage monitor mixer and S16 digital snake
        Dberry I already had the X32 and S16. I bought the M32 because of its better build and warranty/. I understand that the preamps are better but again, I have what I have. I will have to live with the X32 pre-amps until I have the money to buy a Midas DL32 stage box.
        • Apr 11
      • Need routing assistance for m32 FOH, X32 rack stage monitor mixer and S16 digital snake
        KevinMaxwell I understand so I won’t write up my suggestions then.

        But I will make a different suggestion and I am not sure if you have spare inputs to makes this work. I did this with a setup with an X32 in the broadcast control room and an X32Rack behind stage for the IEM mix and at FOH is an Avid console. I had a bunch of analog lines not being used so I took the Monitor outputs (balanced ¼” TRS) on the X32Rack and feed that back to the Avid console. Those inputs on the Avid aren’t routed to go anywhere but to enable you to solo (on the Avid) so you can listed to what you solo on the X32Rack controlling that function with a computer or a tablet. This enables you to listen to (solo) the MixBus sends on the X32 rack so if one of the musicians needs help with their mix you can hear what their mix is and help them out.

        This might be able to be routed on the X32Rack by using ¼” TRS to XLR cables from the monitor outputs to a couple of spare channel inputs or maybe even to a couple of aux inputs. You just need to be sure to mute the MixBus sends to avoid someone sending that monitor signal to somewhere it shouldn’t be.

        To anyone else following along unless you really know what you are doing don’t do this because you could wind up with a nasty loop.
        • Apr 11
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