Midas

Midas

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Midas

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  • Caught exception: Specified column "user_id" is not in the row
  • S-Audio
    Contributor - Level 2
    2020-02-26
    0 121
    • S-Audio
      GaryHiggins

      @S-Audio see pic below, In the card out menu its sending the auxin 1-6/T to card 1-8, but if it's desired for another bank of DAW or X-Live ch's, just use that different bank instead OR setup a "user bank" and pick the aux's and another 2 ch, rather than Talkback, that fits your input DAW or X=Live setup the best.


       


      Screen Shot 2020-02-26 at 3.07.45 PM.png

      • February 26, 2020
    • S-Audio
      S-Audio

      Thanks I'll give that a try. I never even thought to use the software for the M32r. I was trying to figure it out with the screen on the console.......

      • February 26, 2020
  • soundpressure
    Contributor - Level 1
    2020-02-21

    How to use M32 Sine Wave funtion, I can do the system tuning with RTA. Just curious if same could be done with sine wave.

    0 98
    • soundpressure
      RexBeckett

      @soundpressure 


      Hello Ken, welcome to the community.


       


      You could use a succession of sine wave signals at 1/3rd octave frequency intervals to emulate a frequency sweep. In some ways this is better than using pink noise to evaluate system response but it would take a lot longer. It can be quite useful for checking how well crossover filters in active monitors and subs work together.

      • February 21, 2020
  • MAPsound
    Contributor - Level 2
    2020-02-20

    I'm working with a school who had a bunch of salespeople come in and install a TON of stuff they don't need over this rather involved Dante network. Originally all Yamaha-based audio gear (CL3 board and two RIO 1608-d digital snake heads). They didn't care that the board they sold them was INFINITELY too complicated for the volunteers (read: students) to run, they just wanted their commission.
    I come in and convince them to get an M32 with a Dante card. They love the board and aren't afraid to actually use it now. However, my issue is that the head amp knob on the board is only functioning as a digital trim, not actually adjusting the gain on the still-installed RIO stage boxes. (I'm not here to rewire the entire system. Just make what they have usable).

    So how can I get actual head amp control of the stage boxes directly from the M32? I don't want it to be just digital trim. Or is it possible to tie the AES50 directly into the Dante system? I believe it is compatible with AES67. Any help on this is greatly appreciated.

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    0 2,111
    • MAPsound
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi Trevor @MAPsound 


      Welcome to the forum. Unfortunately the AES50 is a proprietary protocol by Klark Teknik (based on their SuperMac protocol) and is not compatible with AES67. It actually only uses layer 1 of the ethernet protocol. Currently it only works with Behringer and Midas stageboxes (and some Klark Teknik devices such as KT9630).


       


      The X32, M32 and the new Wing can only control preamps (gain and phantom) of both local and AES50 inputs. All card inputs will be digital trims. The only way to have preamp control in a dante environment is to use the Dante Controller app on a computer. 


       

      • February 20, 2020
    • MAPsound
      GaryHiggins

      @MAPsound I am not sure how (or if) the M32 gain controls can control the RIO headamps over dante. Not faniliar with those boxes. The M32's were meant to be able to control the Midas and Behringer stagebox preamps or those of another KT based aes50 device. Not saying it can;t for sure though. You might check the setup and make sure HA Gain split is turned of as that would force the M32 to use trim.

      • February 20, 2020
    • MAPsound
      MAPsound

      This is the part where I would normally say something like "then what's the point of having a Dante card? If you can't set the proper gain at the source, then what is the purpose?" But I'm getting used to everything being annoyingly proprietary, even over a more global system like Dante.


      So you're saying there's no way to send a HA control signal, either via Dante or the Ethernet port or anything? That it will ONLY work with the matching stage boxes (S16/DL16, etc.)?

      • February 20, 2020
    • MAPsound
      Paul_Vannatto


      @MAPsound wrote:


      This is the part where I would normally say something like "then what's the point of having a Dante card? If you can't set the proper gain at the source, then what is the purpose?" But I'm getting used to everything being annoyingly proprietary, even over a more global system like Dante.





      Well I think you need to understand what you currently have. The M32 is a product made by Midas (part of the Music Tribe group of companies). The RIO-1608-D is a product made by Yamaha - a totally separate company (and fierce competitor of Midas). Dante is a product of Audinate that is simply a standard medium that connects devices and provides routing, etc. control via their software. The actual preamps are located in the RIO-1608-D stagebox. Therefore the control of those preamps will have to be accomplished remotely. But if one company is unwilling to provide control interface technology with its competitor, the medium (Dante) cannot be blamed. 


       




      So you're saying there's no way to send a HA control signal, either via Dante or the Ethernet port or anything? 



      Not from the M32 console - at least probably not until Uli buys Yamaha and adds it to the Music Tribe group of companies. 


       

      • February 20, 2020
    • MAPsound
      GaryHiggins

      @MAPsoundI ran acoss this software that might allow you to adjust the RIO preamps using a laptop. I only mention this because you made it seem like the M32 could already access the stagebox inputs and that adjusting gain was the only issue. This could be the bridge. Thought I would share it, did not read it closely.


       


      https://usa.yamaha.com/products/proaudio/software/r_remote/index.html

      • February 21, 2020
  • colino_ltapl
    Contributor - Level 2
    2020-02-19

    Hi guys, 

    I have a question and i hope we all can learn from each another. 

    Recently i have updated the firmware of the DP48 to 1.2, after which i am not able to remote control the other units via the 1st unit. 

    Is there a minimum unit to setup in order to do remote control of the other unit? Or is there a special CAT5 Cables we should be using in order for the connectivitiy to get thru. 
    Please take note that all my 5 units has signals passing thru from the M32 Console. 

    Hope to hear from you guys.

    Cheers!

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    0 304
    • colino_ltapl
      Paul_Vannatto


      @colino_ltapl wrote:


      Recently i have updated the firmware of the DP48 to 1.2, after which i am not able to remote control the other units via the 1st unit. 





      Are you trying to change the group names and assignments from the first DP48 or from the M32? If it is from the first DP48 (in the chain), do you have it set  with the remote on (its device ID should say MSTR) and the rest should have remote on and should have unique device ID. Once that is setup, on the master (first) DP48, goto the Broadcast line and press the encoder. 


       


      If you are trying to send from the M32 Library, AES50 screen, we found a bug which the fix will be part of the next release.


       

      • February 19, 2020
    • colino_ltapl
      colino_ltapl

      Hi Paul,


      Appreciate your replies. 


      just to recap, the first DP48 on master and the rest are on their on IDs, after which punch in the broadcast on the first unit and select the other unit ID to control them correct? 


      Unfortunately it doesn't seems to be working. Did i miss out any step?

      • February 19, 2020
    • colino_ltapl
      Paul_Vannatto


      @colino_ltapl wrote:


      Unfortunately it doesn't seems to be working. Did i miss out any step?





      Did you turn on Remote on all the DP48's before pushing the Broadcast?

      • February 19, 2020
  • PatrickGMaillot
    Valued Contributor - Level 2
    2020-02-19
    Preparing new features for X32Automate programs: The X32 "GO" button can be used to launch different automation files (audio alone, audio+automation, etc.) to manage Musicals, Theater plays, shows, etc. First demo at https://youtu.be/bldx4bSH8DU More information at http://x32ram.com
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    0 74
  • tucks
    Contributor - Level 1
    2020-02-17

    Hello,

    I followed the instructions given in the User Manual by the book, but unfortunately the Updater to 2.4 does not recognize my DL16. I have two of them, I tried both (yes, they are in the bootloader mode and yes I am running the console in Administrator mode. Doubeclick and confirming to give Administration privileges does not work as well). Current Firmware revision on both devices is 2.2. Windows recognizes a new USB device when I connect the DL16.

    Error message is C:\Users\User\Downloads>dl16update_2-4.exe
    No DL16 found. Please restart DL16 in bootloader mode (press and hold CONFIG during power on).

    (Not very helpful...)

    How can I proceed?

    Kind regards

    Tobias

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    0 271
  • Erikdunham
    Contributor - Level 1
    2020-02-16
    Not quite sure what I’m doing wrong. I’d like to use the second S16’s outputs 7 & 8 (actually 15/16) as the main L/R Out. I have read & seen in videos that when you hook up 2 S16’s, the main outs default to 15/16, rather than the normal 7/8, but that is not happening. It that default change not going to happen on the M32C? It seemed like something I read was hinting at the idea that it was only on the M32 Rack
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    0 113
    • Erikdunham
      DaveMorrison

      @Erikdunham 


      If your second S16 is set to Mode 2 (receives 9-16 from AES50), Set the M32  Routing : Out 1-16 : Source L&R to Output 15&16. This will work with the default AES50 routing scheme ( Routing: AES50ut 9-16 -> AES50-A {or B} 9-16).

      • February 15, 2020
    • Erikdunham
      GaryHiggins

      @Erikdunham The C has no physical outs so it would show asterisk for the outs. M32-Edit I believe defaults to 15/16 for the output routing, That is user selectable after this point. Since no S16 has more than 8 physical outs and it's only by mode switch that those 8 XLR outputs assignments get changed, maybe that's why 7/8 shows up? (if that's what you are seeing). That may also be true for any X/M32 model with no or less than 16 physical outs. You still need to rout the out 1-16 menu to assign output sources and mode select on the S16's to set one of them to show +8 to get 9-16 as its output sources even if main L/R is 7/8 or 15/16.


       


      EDIT: Sorry Dave, your response wasn't there to see when I wrote mine-happens a lot to me of late.

      • February 15, 2020
  • ghost56
    Contributor - Level 3
    2020-02-14

    Hi all

    its fri and its raining. Not in college today so going to do some work in reason, got to produce an original piece  of work which is easier said than done.

    Thanks again to everyone who contributed to the m32 edit thread, it was just what i needed.

    Reg

    Ian

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    0 87
  • allesbl
    Contributor - Level 2
    2020-02-10

    Hi,

    I don't know if this is the right place to report bugs, but I'll place my post here. Hopefully it will be read by someone responsible for MR18 maintenance and support.

    One month ago I bought MR18 mixer and updated the firmware to latest 1.17 version. Then during tests I found out that the unit can produce a very loud squeal on Main LR output and any Bus 1-6 output after powering it up. As I found later, it was already mentioned in this forum here:

    https://community.musictribe.com/t5/Recording/MR18-Power-On-Start-Up-Noise/td-p/185693

    and here:

    https://community.musictribe.com/t5/Recording/Loud-squeal-after-powering-up-MR18/td-p/180023

    The squeal sound from my MR18 sounds exactly the same as the one posted by Jay Haynes in the first thread.

    This was posted in 2017 and I wonder it is not fixed yet, because the mixer can become really dangerous when power is unexpectedly interrupted and then restored - not only blasting the PA loudspeakers at Main LR, but with in-ears connected to Bus 1-6 it may cause serious hearing damage!!!

    Sorry, but such behaviour of a professional, even Midas-branded product is simply unacceptable, regardless as much as the product is low-priced. Competitor products such as Mackie DL32R don't do this - on power up and after an initial silent period it simply starts to pass audio with last settings applied. No glitches,
    no pops.

    Please, don't state now "you should turn on the mixer first and speakers last". Although this is of course fully true, in a real life with real fallible people it cannot be always fulfilled under all circumstances. An unexpected short power dropout with MR18 is enough to cause big problems, e.g. someone pulls out by mistake the power cord from the socket and then puts it back again.

    Workaround with "Mute at power on" setup option is insufficient. It relies on a user action and therefore is not always guaranteed, despite the sentence in manual "Engage the 'Mute at Power On' to avoid pops during start up." Not to mention, there is no hint of how loud the MR18 "pops" can be. Under "pops" I understand loud but very short signal bursts which can be unpleasant, but mostly not destructive. However, the mixer produces maybe 0.5 sec long squeal signal with wide spectrum and full scale amplitude which totally overdrives anything connected to the outputs.
    Often it could be also required that the device resumes operation after power cycling with last settings applied and without any user intervention. In this case "Mute at power on" option cannot be used.

    Nevertheless, not only to complain, but to be a bit constructive too - with my MR18 I could observe following behaviour:

    - the squeal sound comes from any input channel (1-16, line 17-18) to any Bus 1-6 and/or Main LR output when channel bus sends and/or channel fader are turned up. Bus and main masters are set permanently to 0dB. Squeal to buses comes from all possible tap point selections.

    - the squeal sound comes only from input channels which have a physical input patched. If the channel is not patched (OFF in the routing table) or USB is selected as source, then the squeal sound doesn't appear. Also effect returns don't produce squeal sound, supposed effect sends on all inputs are all the way turned down.

    - the squeal sound doesn't come out of Phones output. There seems to be some automatic muting during power up - phones output is quiet until the squeal on main/bus outputs fades away and then starts to play normally.

    So this would definitely point to an issue with A/D converters / preamps during initialization.

    Such kind of issue can be for sure fixed by a firmware update. If the root cause cannot be solved easily, please apply to all outputs at least automatic muting immediately on boot up, as a first step of the initialization sequence, and automatic unmuting just only after the initialization has been completed and the squeal already faded away. Automatic unmute would take place conditionally depending on the "Mute at power on" setting: TRUE = leave outputs muted until user intervention (same as now), FALSE = unmute automatically after squeal is gone.
    Or maybe a different approach: temporarily reset the routing table at startup so that all channels are not patched and restore it only just after the A/D and preamps have settled properly.
    Adding such relatively simple functionality to next firmware update may well improve the user experience of this - so far working good - product.

    Many thanks in advance!

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    0 738
    • allesbl
      GaryHiggins

      @allesbl In setup, audio/midi "mute output at power cycle" needs to have a check mark in the box.


      z.PNG.

      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi Ales @allesbl 


      Welcome to the forum. I can assure you that this "squeal" is not due to a bug in the firmware, or it would be happening to many of us users. As far as I remember, those 2 threads were the only reports of this issue, and we were unable to replicate the problem ourselves. If you notice that in both cases, the user(s) did not provide a scene file for us to check. I would suggest that you export your scene to a file (using M-Air-Edit for PC, Mac or linux) and attach it to your next post (Choose File below). Then we can have a look and see if we can determine the source of the squeal.


       

      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      allesbl

      Hi Paul,


      thank you for welcome and your quick reaction. Enclosed you can find a .scn file with the setting which produces the squeal on my MR18. Basically, it is a factory default routing with my personal EQ, gate and compressor settings for a small band as a start point for sound check. Channel 14 has the fader and bus sends turned up which is the path for "squeal" to all outputs. If you load this scene into the mixer, wait some time to store it into inernal memory, switch the mixer off and then switch it on back again, you should get the "squeal" on all bus/main outputs during startup - providing that "mute at power on" is not set, I don't know if this is stored in the scene too. If you unpatch the channel 14 to OFF or set the source to USB, then the disturbing sound will not come at next startup. If you repeat this settings on any other input channel 1-16, 17-18, you should get the same result at next power up.


      My unit has serial number S190700210C8H. From my point of view this is definitely a bug. I discovered it randomly, because I'm used to test everything properly before real use, including such "abnormal operation" like power cycling with open loudspeakers and in-ears. Hopefully the attached file will help you to replicate the squeal sound at startup.


       

      ch14-patched-in14_squeal.scn
      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi Ales @allesbl ,


      Thanks for the scene file. I was able to replicate the issue and that was definitely not a squeal. It was more like a synthesizer noise. To be honest, that is the very first time I've heard that come out of the MR18 (or XR18 or X32) in all the years (and many events) that I've done sound with these digital mixers. Granted the norm is to hook everything up, turn on the console, then go around and turn on all of the powered speakers (and do the opposite at the end of the event). But occasionally I do find a powered speaker already on (because someone forgot to turn it off at teardown of last event). 


       


      I do have to admit that you did indeed find a bug. But you have to understand that since no one has provided a scene file to replicate it, it was very difficult to investigate the "bug". Add to that, the  majority of issues we encounter here on the forum are user setting related. We did have a similar scenario with a user with a bizarre EQ settings (on the GEQ) on his X32. With his scene file we were able to replicate it and I sent it off to the developers - and they found the bug. 


       


      I did load one of my good known scenes over top of yours and tried it and got a similar noise. So I initialized the console, then loaded my good known scene and there was a minor pop (expected when you have the powered speaker on before turning on the console), but did not get your (weird) noise. So it is definitely a combination of settings in your scene that is producing this output.


       


      I will inform the developers of this and link your explanation and scene file for an investigation.


       

      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      wolle_1

      Hi Paul,

      I just found this thread. I have the same issue with my MR18 and was in contact with the support team back in 2020 or 21. Their reaction was quite defensive and they pointed me to that "mute on power-cycle" feature to overcome the situation.

      Are there any news about if or when to fix this bug?

      It is really annoying to use the mute feature in several setups and easy to fix in the firmware.

      Thanks for your efforts so far.

      • Jan 23
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