Contributor - Level 2

Group drums for monitor busses

Hee Guys,
A while ago we went from monitor wedges to IEM. A great move and I'm never going back!
And because I'm always thinking about how to make things easier I want to group the drum signal so we can mix in our drums easily.
The setup is a X32 Rack mixer for IEM sending an AES50 signal to the FOH. So we have the rack all to ourselves for IEM.
My plan is to create a stereo sub-group for all the drum channels. Mixing the drums on the Main bus for balance. Then I use two input channels which I route to the stereo Subgroup. 
This way everyone gets the same drum mix on 2 channels and will be able to boost or cut the whole drumkit with two (linked) faders.
But I guess there will be different wishes for the drum mix with specific musicians. Because the original drumchannels are also available, everyone can do this by adding or removing seperate channels of the drums. 
But will this give notable latency between the original channels and the whole mix on the subgroup?

Or maybe there is a better way to make a stereo channel with the whole drumkit? I like to hear your opinions.



 

 

Thieson Contributor - Level 2 2019-06-19

2019-06-19

Group drums for monitor busses

Hee Guys,
A while ago we went from monitor wedges to IEM. A great move and I'm never going back!
And because I'm always thinking about how to make things easier I want to group the drum signal so we can mix in our drums easily.
The setup is a X32 Rack mixer for IEM sending an AES50 signal to the FOH. So we have the rack all to ourselves for IEM.
My plan is to create a stereo sub-group for all the drum channels. Mixing the drums on the Main bus for balance. Then I use two input channels which I route to the stereo Subgroup. 
This way everyone gets the same drum mix on 2 channels and will be able to boost or cut the whole drumkit with two (linked) faders.
But I guess there will be different wishes for the drum mix with specific musicians. Because the original drumchannels are also available, everyone can do this by adding or removing seperate channels of the drums. 
But will this give notable latency between the original channels and the whole mix on the subgroup?

Or maybe there is a better way to make a stereo channel with the whole drumkit? I like to hear your opinions.



 

 

Highlighted
Contributor - Level 3

Re: Group drums for monitor busses

Should be fine in terms of latency (the console is marketed as "bus-coherant,") as long as:

  1. You stay digital and don't use an analogue loopback to get the drum bus onto spare channels.
  2. You don't use any inserts on the drum bus.

The main issue is that although you can use the individual drum channels to add more of a particular drum to an IEM mix, you can't take it away if there's too much of a particular drum in the submix.  If the submix has KSH, you can use the snare channel to add more snare to an individual mix, but there's no way to get less snare if there's too much in the submix without affecting everyone.  All that person can do is drop the subgroup level down to where they're happy with the snare sound, then bring up other individual drums to compensate for those other drum levels having dropped as a result of the subgroup level being lowered.  At this stage they're essentially mixing drums on a per-channel basis anyway, which defeats the purpose of you having a subgroup for level control anyway.

I suggest that if you've got people mixing their own monitors and they have Andriod tables, get the mixing station app and look into the iDCAs.  The iDCAs are like FOH DCAs, but you can have them apply to channels in monitor mixes.  People can adjust the level of individual drum sounds as they prefer (which is essentially what they have to do anyway as described above) but they can use the iDCA fader to control the overall level of the drums in their own IEM mix.  In fact people can use multiple iDCAs for multiple parts of the IEM mix, eg one for their own channel (essentially a "more me" fader) one for all the drums, one for all of the guitars, one for all the backing vox etc.)  With a custom fader layout, once it's set up, it makes it easy to mix a 32-channel monitor mix on a handful of faders, and it's easy to keep themselves on top with the "more me" fader when things get busy.