Question on Ultranet Channels on M32 and DL16/32

Contributor - Level 1
Can anybody shed some light on the Ultranet channels for me? What I need to know is:

If you are using an M32 via 2 x DL16s are the two Ultranet ports independant of each other allowing you to route to up to 32 separate speakers/ devices? Further to this. Can you also use the Ultranet output on the M32 to add a 3rd set of 16 channels giving you the ability to route to 48 individual items.

The reason I ask this is due to us considering using an M32 with 8 full range and 8 sub turbosound berlins. Using all 16 channels of an Ultranet link . I am interested to know if we needed to increase the size of the rig how we could make further channels available to route to additional FOH speakers and or be able to provide additional channels to run monitors from FOH.

Re: Question on Ultranet Channels on M32 and DL16/32

Volunteer Moderator
HI Stuart,

Welcome to the forum. Yes indeed you can have separate Ultranet feeds as long as the DL16 are connected to separate AES50 ports on the back of the M32. The Ultranet port on the back of the M32 gets its assignments from the Routing, Ultranet (formerly P16) screen. Each of the AES50 ports gets the Ultranet from the 5th and 6th banks (Routing, AES50-a and AES50-b).

That said, if you are planning on having each FOH tops and subs individually controlled on the M32 as well as monitors, you are going to run into bus limitations (mixbuses, matrix, Main LR, Mono) that would be required to provide the master fader for each send. Is there a reason why you don't simply send a FOH left, right and sub feed, then assign the separate speakers to similar Ultranet channels. For example I typically assign subs to output 14, Main Left to 15, Main Right to 16. If I was using the Ultranet for these speakers, I would assign channel 14 on each sub DSP, 15 on each FOH Left speaker and 16 on each FOH Right speaker
Paul Vannatto, Volunteer Forum Administrator and Moderator

Re: Question on Ultranet Channels on M32 and DL16/32

Contributor - Level 3
The short answer is yes, you can do that, with the caveat being that you can get 48 unique signals, depending on what they are (eg if some are DOs from preamps, this makes it easy, but if they're all mixes generated by the console, then at most you can get 38.) This will also limit what you can do with the console's\DL16's own analogue outputs.

The ultranet socket on the console will always output whatever you've got set in the routing>ultranet tab.

The ultranet socket on the DL16 will output either:
AES50 33-48, if in mode 1-3.
DOs from that DL16's preamps, if in mode 4-6 or 9-10.
AES50 1-16, if in mode 7-8.
Be aware that in mode 7-10, the DL16 will be clock master.

You could send AES50 1-16 to 1 DL16 in mode7-8 (which would have to be the system's clock master,) and other 16 different signals via AES50 33-48 to the other DL16 set in mode1-3. If the DL16 being clock master is a problem, you could achieve the same thing by having 1 DL16 connected on AES50A, and the other on AES50B, but then you'd need an extra ethernet run between the console and the stage.

You can duplicate signals if you need (output the same signals (or a subset of 8) on both DL16s if you want. Also if all the subs are going to run the same mix, you can just run one channel as the sub mix, and all the subs tune in to that one channel; you don't need 8 channels for 8 subs if they're all to be running the same mix, so there's a potential to save some channels there. What you need to be asking yourself is how many *unique* signals you need. 16 speakers is one thing, but if they're all only going to be running one of L\R\M, then that's only 3 signals you need in the ultranet bus (multiple speakers can tune in to the one ultranet channel,) which leaves 13 more for *different* signals, eg monitors, front\side fills fed by mtxs etc.

Re: Question on Ultranet Channels on M32 and DL16/32

Contributor - Level 1
Craig / Paul

Many thanks. That is brilliant. I was under the assumption that each Ultranet fed speaker had to be on it's own individuall channel!! This is great . Well 13 spare should be plenty for mons if we have to use FOH (we intend using an M32R for mons for most events). Again many thanks and I am sure I will have a few more questions whilst I am working through the spec for our upgrade.

Re: Question on Ultranet Channels on M32 and DL16/32

Contributor - Level 3
You're welcome.

The other thing you'll want to consider is a P16-D (or 2, depending on DL16 placement around the stage.) It's sort of undocumented that an ultranet signal doesn't like being daisy-chained for >6 speakers, and you've got 16. You could run DL16>P16D, then run 4 ethernet cables from that P16D, one to FOHL, one to FOHR, and 2 to 4x subs. You stage 16 signals from the routing>ultranet bus including your LRM (or matrices, however you're doing it,) all 16 signals hit the DL16s, all 16 signals hit the P16-D(s), all 16 signals hit the speakers, then it's a matter of "tuning" those speakers into the correct signal in that group of 16. Do this *before* you fly them.

You'll also want to consider whether you want to use the "speaker modelling" feature on any ultranet connected speakers and manage it from FOH (personally I think it's a bit of a gimmick,) as that will determine how you need to do your AES50 connectivity (and how many ethernet runs) you'll need between stageboxes, the monitor mixer, and the FOH mixer.