Contributor - Level 2

Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

Hello,

My band has five members that include, a drummer, bass guitar, one acoustic/electric rhythm guitar and an electric rhythm guitar, a lead guitar and three vocals.  The bass guitar and the lead guitar play through their own amps however, I'm planning on mic'ing them up for larger venues.  The two rhythm guitars are connected directly to the mixer and play through the PA system.  Our PA system is a Bose L1S1 linear array with a bass sub that is connected to a MIdas MR18 mixer.  We use Senheiser E835 mics for vocals.  Everything in the attached scene is panned to the left for smaller gigs using just one Bose speaker and panned to the center when we do larger gigs with two Bose systems.  I'm not a sound guy but I'm trying very hard to learn the trade, not to make a living at it but more so for my band's sound.  I've attached my band's scene to this message for your review. Basically the band uses channels 1 through 8.  The other channels are just instruments I was experimenting with.

I know, every room, band, gig setting, mics etc are going to be different but I'm guessing that most of you sound guys have your "go to" initial settings when you set up for a new gig.  That being said here's my questions.  Can someone please look at my scene and give me some input on what's right or wrong?  The other thing is; can I get some suggestions on how and what initial settings to use for when I mic the bass and lead guitars?  One last question, if someone has a similar band could you please post your scene so I can compare our settings?  

Thank you in advance for any input and help.

 

 

WilliamPanto Contributor - Level 2 2019-08-28

2019-08-28

Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

Hello,

My band has five members that include, a drummer, bass guitar, one acoustic/electric rhythm guitar and an electric rhythm guitar, a lead guitar and three vocals.  The bass guitar and the lead guitar play through their own amps however, I'm planning on mic'ing them up for larger venues.  The two rhythm guitars are connected directly to the mixer and play through the PA system.  Our PA system is a Bose L1S1 linear array with a bass sub that is connected to a MIdas MR18 mixer.  We use Senheiser E835 mics for vocals.  Everything in the attached scene is panned to the left for smaller gigs using just one Bose speaker and panned to the center when we do larger gigs with two Bose systems.  I'm not a sound guy but I'm trying very hard to learn the trade, not to make a living at it but more so for my band's sound.  I've attached my band's scene to this message for your review. Basically the band uses channels 1 through 8.  The other channels are just instruments I was experimenting with.

I know, every room, band, gig setting, mics etc are going to be different but I'm guessing that most of you sound guys have your "go to" initial settings when you set up for a new gig.  That being said here's my questions.  Can someone please look at my scene and give me some input on what's right or wrong?  The other thing is; can I get some suggestions on how and what initial settings to use for when I mic the bass and lead guitars?  One last question, if someone has a similar band could you please post your scene so I can compare our settings?  

Thank you in advance for any input and help.

 

 

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Volunteer Moderator

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene


@WilliamPanto wrote:

If you get a chance, I would love to see the scene you made up for the "similar" band.


Here you go Willie

 

Paul Vannatto, Volunteer Forum Administrator and Moderator. Did you find my post helpful? Give kudos or mark it as a solution!

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Volunteer Moderator

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

You forgot to attach your scene William @WilliamPanto  (Choose File below)

Paul Vannatto, Volunteer Forum Administrator and Moderator. Did you find my post helpful? Give kudos or mark it as a solution!
Contributor - Level 2

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

When I enter edit mode for my message it shoes the scene attached.  Is there another step needed to upload a file?

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Contributor - Level 2

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

I was able to attach my scene to the previous relpy.  For some reason it wouldn't upload on my first posting.

Volunteer Moderator

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

Hi William @WilliamPanto

I had a quick look at your scene and at first I didn't see anything glaringly wrong. But I did notice that the channel sends to buses 5 and 6 are tapped a subgroups and the Main LR of those bus outputs are enabled. That means that you have in essence 2 parallel paths of those channels to Main LR. Unless you have specific reasons (eg. parallel compression, etc.) for parallel paths, it should be avoided, since it can cause you grief. I would suggest you change those sends taps (to buses 5/6) to post EQ (like the others).

 

The channel sends to the 3 monitor buses don't seem to be setup at all (nothing is being sent and master bus faders are all the way down). I usually start with rough monitor mixes so that the musicians have something to work with when they fine tune their mixes.

 

Sends to each of the FX are very low and the FX returns are at 0 db. I do it the other way around. I usually set the lead vocal sends to just below 0 db and backing vocals to just above 0db, and blend the FX returns to suit (typically around -10 db). This way the gain structure (reducing noise floor) is setup correctly.

 

Unless the vocals have strong singing voices, the 20 db gain for those e835 are a bit low. I start at 25 db and adjust according to the individual vocals.

 

The 4th vocal channel (Voc-Skip) is not in any mute group. Since you have a small active channel count, I would suggest you put them all (the active ones) in the same mute group, since you will probably be muting all and unmuting just the active channels.

 

Paul Vannatto, Volunteer Forum Administrator and Moderator. Did you find my post helpful? Give kudos or mark it as a solution!
Contributor - Level 2

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

Hi Paul,

Thank you for your input, it's very appreciated.  Using the Bose system we have found we don't need monitors anymore, that's why none of the aux busses are set up.  I guess I don't understand the FX sends and returns or how to use/set them up.  Could you give me a quick tutorual?

Volunteer Moderator

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

Hi William @WilliamPanto,

Sends to FX work in a similar manner as sending to a monitor bus. But the FX engine processes that mix irrespective of its content. That means that if the signals sent to it are low (eg. -20 db) it will process those signals along with any other potential signals (noise floor - eg. hiss, etc.). If you boost the resulting (wet) signal from the FX engine, you will end up with the (wet) signals from the channels as well as the noise floor being boosted. It is better to send good strong channel signals to the FX (reducing potential noise floor), then adjust the FX return to blend the wet and dry signals. Attached is an adjusted scene of how I would set it up.

 

When I get home, I'll attach an MR18 scene of a band that I frequently do sound for that is a bit similar to your setup.

 

 

Paul Vannatto, Volunteer Forum Administrator and Moderator. Did you find my post helpful? Give kudos or mark it as a solution!
Contributor - Level 2

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

Thank You Paul,

I'm a visual guy so, seeing the changes you made helped me understand what you were saying.  Thanks.

If you get a chance, I would love to see the scene you made up for the "similar" band.

Thanks again,

Willie

Volunteer Moderator

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene


@WilliamPanto wrote:

If you get a chance, I would love to see the scene you made up for the "similar" band.


Here you go Willie

 

Paul Vannatto, Volunteer Forum Administrator and Moderator. Did you find my post helpful? Give kudos or mark it as a solution!

View solution in original post

Contributor - Level 2

Re: Suggestions to improve my Band's Scene

Thanks for posting the scene.

I thought I understood what you were saying about setting the FX busses, but as usual, I'm still confused.  lol.

I understand what you said about sending a strong signal to the buss but I'm confused about how one would go about adding or removing a particular effect on an individual channel.  If I adjust the slider on the FX buss it changes all of the channels?  If I adjust the slider on the channel it doesn't seem to have much effect.  Also, under the sends tabhow and when should I adjust the FX sends?

As always, Thanls for your help.  Smiley Happy